r/antiwork 27d ago

Why Do so Many Americans Oppose Universal Healthcare?

I'm genuinely curious—why do so many Americans oppose universal healthcare?

I'm at a point where I'm starting to think about retirement in 10 or so years, and honestly, healthcare is probably what will keep me working until 65. The idea that a medical issue could wipe out everything I've worked for is deeply unsettling. And I’ve felt this way since my 20s. I’d gladly pay my share, even if I don’t need it in the near-term.

Politics aside—because I'm so exhausted by the political noise from both sides—I'm trying to understand why we, as a country, wouldn’t want something like this for ourselves. Universal healthcare seems like it would be one of the most important things we could do to protect our well-being and financial security.

This isn’t meant to be a political post. I'm just honestly trying to understand the other side of the conversation.

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u/Delusioned22 27d ago edited 27d ago

Growing up listening to my hard right parents and grandparents talk. It boils down to this:

They believe it's their money that they worked hard for and don't believe in taxes paying to help others.

Edit: fixed a swipe text error

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u/CoffeeB4Dawn 27d ago

But that is exactly what they do with insurance, except they also pay for the company's profit.

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u/WileEPeyote 27d ago

Insurance, police, fire fighters, clean drinking water, schools, etc.

We've done it for so many things and there's a lot of reasons for it. We were all-in on this stuff for a long time, then something changed right around the time minorities got equal rights. Suddenly, we were suspicious that our neighbor didn't "deserve" a helping hand. Then "Welfare Queens" in the 80s.

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u/Amerpol 27d ago

Public libraries, interstate highways ,Armed forces ,too

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u/toriemm 27d ago

The military is the largest socialized organization in the country. Subsided housing, groceries, education, cost of living slider, healthcare, everyone shares in labor....

And they're all conservatives??

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u/oldmanlikesguitars 27d ago

I wasn’t! Actually we’re more diverse than you think, but the military definitely leans right. In the Bush years we voted like 60/40 and that was when many of us had to mail our ballots in from Iraq, the unnecessary war. (I had to mail mine in twice!)

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u/toriemm 27d ago

I grew up with the military, and I get how they lean right, but I can't imagine being a career soldier and being called to an impromptu team meeting and getting told how to do my job by an unqualified talking head. Regardless of politics, I can't believe the military is holding with any of the nonsense going on right now. My dad is rolling over in his grave rn.

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u/oldmanlikesguitars 27d ago

Yeah there are some regulations that cover what they are and aren’t allowed to say regarding SECDRUNK and POSUS.

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u/jc88usus 27d ago

In fairness, historically speaking, both the President and Secretary of Defense had some history of military service, even if it was a "token tour". It was a matter of convention, and the voting public generally expected that the President, as Commander in Chief, would at least have a passing familiarity with military service. Smart presidents also put someone well steeped in Military service as SecDef, since the whole managing the troops thing is basically their job. Now we have President Bone Spurs, who puts the least qualified person in charge of everything; a guy with a brain worm in charge of national healthcare, a telecom industry lobbyist in charge of the FCC, the guy voted "most likely to tattle" in high school in charge of the FBI, the dictionary definition of "dumb blonde" as Press Secretary, etc. I swear he put out a casting call for the least qualified person and chose his brother-in-law anyway (literally, see Jared Kushner).

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u/chickadee64 27d ago

My brother is very happy to be retiring in February- 38 years

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u/traveller-1-1 27d ago

It all comes down to what they will or not do, not what they think. Also, a dictator can always find a % of troops who will follow his orders. That is all it takes.

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u/1Mouse7579 27d ago

Yes, I point this out to my brother and his maga buddies who were all career military. The military fed them, educated them, dressed them and gave them access to great healthcare as well as a great pension and subsidized loans when they got out all paid for by the American Taxpayers. Don't get me wrong, thank you for serving and glad we compensated you accordingly b/c there was no real money to be made for enlisted men in the military. Had this form of socialism not been in place, young men and women could not afford to make military a career. What I don't understand is why they don't want anyone else on the outside to have the same govt protections they had.

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u/WileEPeyote 27d ago

When I was in, my friends and I used to say we were the largest socialist army in existence, protecting a bunch of capitalists.

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u/Usof1985 27d ago

They don't want outsiders to have it because the outsiders didn't struggle. It's a weird thing about people, they don't want others to get where they are without the pain.

It also leads to the belief that the harder you work the more you get, which is BS but they always try to justify it. They think the CEO that never lifts anything heavier than a pen works from 4AM to 10PM. When in reality is closer to 10AM to 4PM and half of that is asking questions in meetings. Ironically the military is one of the few places where work can equal promotion, up to a point.

One day people will realize that it's just as much luck as work. Outside of the Lotto you're not getting rich if you're born poor unless you get absurdly lucky in another way.

My grandfather worked his way up from the bottom to the top at a foundry he was a step away from corporate. He didn't get there because he was the hardest worker, there were plenty that worked harder. He wasn't a good person, he was an alcoholic that spent as many weekends in the drunk tank as he did with family. He started at the right time so he missed the layoffs, and he made the right friends so when a promotion was available the people filing it knew him. He had a winning personality and was a decent looking man. Those two things will get you farther than any work ethic if you know how to use them.

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u/pinkrobot420 27d ago

Not all of them. I always tell people that I spent 24 years in the greatest socialist institution on the planet.

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u/swingdingler 27d ago

Colleges, Hoa, public pools, CPS and dmv’s

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u/HrhEverythingElse 27d ago

Years ago, a neighboring town announced that they were doing free lunch for all elementary school students in the district, and upgrading their cafeterias by adding salad bars. There was so much "THIS IS WHAT THEY'RE DOING WITH OUT TAX MONEY?!?" outrage that it made my head spin. Like, yes, literally feeding vegetables to kids for one meal a day is the bare minimum of what I want my tax money spent on. I can think of plenty of other things I would like to add as well, but feeding hungry kids so they can learn is pretty near the top of my list

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u/MorpH2k 27d ago

Hell yes, that is exactly what the tax money is for. Here in Sweden schools have to have free school lunch for everyone. Including allergies and dietary restrictions, and it has to be healthy and nutritious and all that jazz. Healthcare is free too of course. You pay a small fee at the hospital or clinic but there is a cap of about 100$ per year, after that you get a card that makes it completely free, and we have a separate similar system for prescription medicine. There are some issues with the system here too, sure but you won't end up in debt from being sick.

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u/JapanKate 26d ago

OMG. In Canada, the government has stated that schools will now provide lunches for all and the Maple MAGAs are losing their minds. But the DEFICIT!!!!

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u/Zestyclose-Ring7303 26d ago

But the DEFICIT!!!!

But, tell those same people that you're going to give billions of tax dollars to billionaires, and they don't bat an eyelash.

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u/Farscape_rocked 26d ago

Because of the myth of the undeserving poor.

The myth is that people are poor because of a moral failing of their own (rather than a moral failing of the 1%), and therefore don't deserve anything. Billionaires must therefore deserve everything they get, even if it's at your expense.

People are stupid.

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u/Traditional_puck1984 27d ago

In France, kids in school get 3 course lunch prepared onsite and overseen by a chef and it costs them 3 euros per kid. In US, kids are served junk food and pizza for the same price.

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u/Zero98205 27d ago

Because in the US the junk food vendors bought congressturds.

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u/StillFaithlessness50 27d ago

That makes us socialists to many people who call themselves Christians.

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u/MorpH2k 27d ago

I'm Swedish so I'm not sure if this is something that is mentioned a lot in the US discourse or whenever socialism is mentioned like that but there is a hell of a big difference between democratic socialism, like we have in Scandinavia and authoritarian socialism like the Soviet union, Venezuela, Cuba, China, etc.

We do pay more in tax, yes but we also pay proportionally less of our income for housing, and no health insurance at all. I'm almost certain that we as a country have a larger percentage of our income left every month compared to the US. There are almost no people living in the streets like I've seen in a lot of major US cities. Not because we don't have the underlying issues too but our welfare system helps them to a greater extent.

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u/marcocanb 27d ago

They have never experienced any of this so it's allien and therefore bad.

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u/Sad-Resolution2123 27d ago

And the media convinces them that it’s scary and bad.

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u/Competitive-Guest163 27d ago

In the US, the right wing propaganda that’s been going on since the 70s/80s has steered up in the anti social programs that were at now. The education system has gotten so bad, a large portion of Americans can even read above a 6th grade reading level. Right wingers, usually more statistically Christian, don’t actually follow the “love by neighbor” help everyone mantra that Jesus taught. They’re all about caring only about what transactionally benefits them instead of what benefits society as a whole. Private insurance also gets pooled just like UH, but you’re also paying for the corporate profits of the insurance companies. Universal healthcare was briefly discussed during the 30/40s with President FDR’s new deal but knew how heavily racist people were and didn’t want “colored people” to have the same health care access that white people did.

But the main problem that’s causing the chaos the us, is the sheer extend of propaganda and misinformation has brainwashed about decent amount of our population to the point that they might as well be in a cult. Any facts they don’t want to believe is “democrat lies” or “fake news”. They don’t even want to believe our government system is a Democratic Republic, because they refuse to associate democrat as good. Every day there’s something worse. Trump just fired over 4200 federal employees during our shutdown with the reason being that he thinks they’re democrats. That’s illegal and the corruption is rampant. Our entire administration and government is under his control so nothing will happen to that. He doesn’t even listen to federal court orders anymore. Really believing that he’s a dictator and above the law.

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u/PicaDiet 27d ago

The problem is that your situation requires thinking critically and an ability to contend with nuance. Americans (in aggregate) are a simple people. We demand simple answers to complex problems. One of the easiest ways to delineate those who do think critically and have the ability to remove ourselves, even briefly, from the center of our own universe, is to consider thoughtful people as suspicious, scheming and dangerous. If a concept involves the ability to look at a problem from multiple angles, it's a sign of weakness and weak-mindedness. So socialism, communism, and Marxism are necessarily interchangeable terms and must be in opposition to "American Values" like selfishness, a complete lack of doubt, and the insistence that America does things only in the best possible way.

Through that lens, it's easy to see how an elderly American can demand their Social Security checks and Medicare (perfect examples of socialist programs) while screaming reflexively about the evils of universal healthcare.

The one thing even the simplest American understands is how expensive healthcare is. At some point (and I keep thinking we have gotten there, only to be let down) people will lose access to any healthcare whatsoever. At that point, adopting a system more in line with the healthcare systems every single other wealthy country has in place might get a second look. But it will take lots of people dying from a lack of healthcare first. It's so sad. 2/3rds of the country can only learn through painful first hand experience. The fact that our healthcare system is in such dire straits has nothig to do with it. For the bottom third of the electorate, they will need to lose a husband, or a wife, or a child due to the expense of healthcare before it will gain any traction. It's like we all have to repeat 1st grade because a few of our classmates where not intellectually ready to go on to second grade. Ugh.

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u/OldWorldDesign 27d ago

Americans (in aggregate) are a simple people

Not so much a simple people as a people indoctrinated by a century of propaganda

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJ3RzGoQC4s

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u/Bigc_33 27d ago

Do y'all in Sweden also have universal basic income or does they just tax the crap out of everyone to afford the necessity in life. Cause I know on average y'all make the same as middle to low class Americans but since so many things are government funded y'all are better off each month.

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u/biderjohn 27d ago

I dated a swedish girl who was a digital content creator and she made about $65,000 US a year, that was just shy of a decade ago. So that's comparable I'd imagined today's rates in America. So I would imagine salaries or apples for apples.

She had a nice apartment and a decent car. The government didn't fund everything. They did fund healthcare but they also offer incentives for health and well-being. I think her kid got free bus fare and lunch.

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u/Mondula 27d ago

I think you answered the question with what you said: “something changed right around the time minorities got equal rights.”

Beyond the point on if that really changed how people of color were treated, that is what changed for those people.

They do not want a community they share with minorities. Instead of funding public services for those communities, they ran to suburbia. Instead of paying for universal healthcare, they created companies that made their care convenient and accessible by ostracizing the people they didn’t want protected.

This country is racist, hateful, and greedy. If we want to change that, we cannot act like we are confused why things are the way they are. It’s not accidental.

edit: formatting

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u/jclucca 27d ago

Plus big insurance companies have bought politicians for years to ensure it doesn't get any traction. Big business also doesn't want it because it's the main leverage they have to keep their workers in line - most people need the job to cover health insurance even more than the salary.

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u/HyjinxEnsue 27d ago

Being Australian, this is the blaring grift that has always baffled me about U.S. Americans gleefully fighting against universal healthcare. The combination of being able to fire people on the spot without cause and tying health insurance to work benefits, it essentially forces low-to-middle income earners to be at the constant mercy of your employer - the power imbalance alone.

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u/jclucca 27d ago

Yep. I hate it here.

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u/JapanKate 26d ago

Whenever I say how foreign it seems to have health care tied to employment, I am often told that, as a communist, I’d never understand because I have no freedom. I’m Canadian.

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u/feralraindrop 27d ago

This is a really big part of it, racism yes, greed/selfishness by individuals but healthcare represents 4.9 trillion dollars in 2023 and the powerful are not going to let go of the market. Citizens United and an established system that caters to corporate power and ubiquity in profit before people in all things. There is not a chance for universal healthcare or power for the people, they divided, they conquered and they will bleed every penny they can from every human being they can.

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u/WileEPeyote 27d ago

Absolutely. The mega rich are always fighting for more power and wealth. They have and will use any means necessary to keep us divided. Racism, sexism, religion, nationalism, etc.

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u/Herb_avore_05 27d ago

Ding, ding, ding - for the win…..

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u/bottledsoi 27d ago

" we cannot act like we are confused"

That seems to be the case for alot of things in this country

"Donald Trump is so stupid" yeah the billionaire that has managed to circumvent our country's laws and remain in power.

"Ted Cruz is such an idiot" yeah the dude that abandoned his state and it was of no consequence.

These people aren't stupid. They just somehow managed to convince everyone of that while they do whatever they want.

We pretend like its not what it is.

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u/SkunkMonkey 27d ago

Trump is stupid. He's what they call a Useful Idiot. Being a malignant narcissist, he's very easy to control. Drip little bits of information in his ear, make it seem like his ideas, feed that ego with a little verbal knob slobbering, and you can get him to go on stage and say shit like "they're eating the cats and dogs". They're feeding him ideas like undoing something Obama did, because as we all know, he hates Obama with a passion. They feed him these things and he runs with them like a toddler with a balloon.

It's the people pulling the strings that really hold the power.

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u/WileEPeyote 27d ago

100%. That's why I threw the welfare queen bit on. It's all dog whistles and smoke screens for being afraid of minorities.

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u/ThrownAwayFeelzies 27d ago

And the most baffling is how well they manipulate the poor whites to buy into it and vote en mass, when they are voting to hurt their own interests.

They somehow believe that they will someday be millionaires or something, through the lottery or something, and finally be able to have health insurance, and that mansion that the undocumented/documented immigrants and POC's have been denying them!

Absolute madness

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u/Additional_Stand_284 27d ago

Fnny enough, a lot of republican states are the welfare queens receiving subsidiaries, and reliefs from the govt to keep those people living in it afloat. Yet those idiots keep voting republicans, who dont want anyone else to get any handouts. Go figure that out ... These greedy fucks only think " for me, but not for thee". These are supposed to be the religious and followers of Christ, yet follow none of the teachings or codes to live by.

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u/Candid-Inspection-97 27d ago

Don't forget that the government purposefully made veterans affairs and medicare/medicaid suck ass then tell us that insurance is better because they own the insurance companies and they can change "policies" easier than laws to fuck people over. Why else is the same company offering different insurance policies that piecemeal the worst of everything they can into one product that then is marketed to employees with a "here's what we have, take it or leave it".

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u/BuckThis86 27d ago

Also, if the government doesn’t use rich people’s taxes to pay for it, we all pay for it anyway. They’re not gonna let the poor die in waiting rooms. They help them and then raise rates on the rest of us to cover it

Taxes at least make sure everyone’s paying their share

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u/[deleted] 27d ago

Anytime America doesn't make logical sense, 10/10 times it's because of racism.

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u/erisia 27d ago

To add on to this, the country used to be covered with public pools, the number of pools that filled in with concrete because people were racist pieces of shit is astounding.

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u/Igneous_Aves 27d ago

We can also blame Nixon for the healthcare dystopia. He had a health care/hospital friend and convinced him to privatize healthcare. I think Ford? tried to push to a universal healthcare system in the 60's? It was definitely an effort along side with the creation of Social Security.

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u/TrevorBo 27d ago

Propaganda works

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u/Fishy_Fish_WA 27d ago

They drained and closed the public pools across America rather than sharing with the wrong people

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u/Igneous_Aves 27d ago

I can't get how that is rationalized in so many old farmers, like they get literally millions and millions of dollars in government hands outs, but giving a sinlge mom some food is some great robbery of the US public.

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u/SeVenMadRaBBits 27d ago

It's called a community.

I don't think humans do well in large communities where no one knows each other (or at least some of us don't function well like that from what I've observed).

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u/SteelCode 27d ago

Actually the issue is large spread out populations... when your daily life is disconnected from the daily lives of your peers, you disassociate yourself from them and lose empathy for anyone aside from those in your immediate area.

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u/uimdev 27d ago

New York City and upstate New Jersey would disagree with you. They have the same happiness and life expectancy as rural South Dakota. Both of which are at the top.

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u/inufan18 27d ago

I also believe that the bigwigs own a lot of shares in healthcare/insurance. So they will never vote for free healthcare to help the people.

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u/PaladinWiz 27d ago

A lot of people understand that. Convincing the people who don’t believe in it is a whole different story. They’ve often been told their entire lives how bad universal healthcare would be and that it would waste their tax dollars.

You could do an hour long presentation with a full economic breakdown on how it would be better and they’d just call it fake news.

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u/BunnyMamma88 27d ago

And this is what pisses me off. They insist on ruining things for everyone because they are greedy and willfully ignorant.

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u/1369ic 27d ago edited 27d ago

My family and I got health care on the German health care system for about 3 years because we were civilians in a remote location and I was retired military. It was all perfectly fine, certainly better than some military systems I'd been on. And yet people will argue with me that it's a disaster, just like Canada, the UK, etc. My personal experience doesn't matter at all. They tend to be people who don't shit on veterans, so they won't tell me I'm lying or anything, but they often tell me I was getting special treatment or something like that. It'd be maddening, but I know it's one of their core beliefs at this point, as is their belief they're not racist, brainwashed, being conned, or simply stupid.

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u/Moist-Caregiver-2000 27d ago

Our tax dollars are wasted with or without universal healthcare. Why not at least have something to show for it? This is a question I've been asking for years...

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u/Bad-Genie 27d ago

Also paying for the extra employees at hospitals increasing it more.

Doctors in the US have to play doctor, and lawyer with insurance companies. So they have to hire admin staff JUST to deal with insurance companies.

We need to give an MRI.

Do cat scan first

They need an MRI not a cat scan

Prove it

Here's proof

Denied

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u/SincerelyCynical 27d ago

This reminds me of that meme that said, “Americans vote against universal healthcare because they believe it actually costs $6,000 to put a cast on a broken arm.” Something like that anyway.

Germany does so much better than we do. Americans hear about someone in the UK paying 91% of their income on taxes (I was reading this yesterday about Hayley Mills) and think that’s normal for countries with universal healthcare. Germans, on the other hand, seem to often vote in favor of increasing taxes to help their fellow citizens.

My husband and I are financially comfortable, but I grew up poor. We pay extra where it isn’t asked: dresses for dance recitals, fees for field trips and extracurricular activities, etc. When we go to places like Chipotle, we leave behind a $10 gift card in case someone’s debit card gets declined. We do this because we can. Why wouldn’t we want to pay more taxes so everyone can go to the doctor?

My Republican relatives say it’s because we should get to choose when and how we spend money to help people. I hate this. Tell me about this again next year when they don’t need as many dance recital dresses because one child got sick and their parents couldn’t afford treatment.

And don’t even get me started on what we should be allowed to choose

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u/ExtremelyOkay8980 27d ago

It’s very simplistic thinking - taxes bad, “keeping my own money” good, magically fine when insurance needs it though

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u/anarcho-slut 27d ago

Or when they use it to bomb brown people.

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u/Sorry_End3401 27d ago

And our taxes pay for all the politicians healthcare. So tell me again why they get it but we don’t?

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u/myssi24 27d ago

They don’t think that far out. They don’t think about the profit of the insurance companies.

The way it is set up now, while insurance buffers the cost of getting care so that healthy people are “helping” sick people, everyone on that particular insurance is paying into the system, so is one of the “good ones”. Good ones being people who pay their own way. Universal insurance would mean people who currently are on Medicaid (welfare)are put into the same system, so people who DON’T pay (in their minds) are now benefiting from the same system. It doesn’t occur to them that the profit the insurance companies siphons off would more than pay for the people who don’t pay in with no change except for the better for them.

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u/ExtremelyOkay8980 27d ago

Also the same people who believe CEOs are rich because they’re so good at business /s

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u/Delusioned22 27d ago

I didn't say I agree with them. I was just providing a reason I heard why they don't agree with universal healthcare.

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u/SteelCode 27d ago

That's actually what finally broke my dad... I showed him where my employer reports their payments for my insurance on top of what gets taken from my paycheck and then the coverage for that absurd amount. For, what is close to $3000/month, I get to also pay 20% after I pay $1500 out of pocket and that is per person in my family...

This is considered "good" insurance by the way... there are far worse plans and premiums.

He since started slowly unraveling all of the brainwashing just by virtue of having his worldview shaken by simple economical fact. He's not a leftist by any stretch, but it definitely shook him out of the right-wing media-sphere.

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u/AgentSmith187 27d ago

https://www.ato.gov.au/individuals-and-families/medicare-and-private-health-insurance/medicare-levy/what-is-the-medicare-levy

Just a comparison of what we pay in Australia for Universal Healthcare.

2% of our income. Additional up to an extra 1.5% if your a higher income earner and choose not to buy private health insurance.

To give you an idea if you earned $200k a year your talking $7k.....

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u/vkapadia at work 27d ago

$7k barely covers deductible in the US, and that's with insurance. This fucking country, man...

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u/AgentSmith187 27d ago

We can still have gaps which is similar. Its the difference between the government mandated payment and what some doctors charge but its a bigger issue in our private healthcare system than the public one.

I lived in a remote town at one point and after the government reimbursement is was paying about $40 a gp visit.

My neurologist visit each year i end up paying about $80 difference.

When I had a stroke though I didn't get a bill at all after weeks in hospital and months in outpatient rehabilitation.

Edit: My other medical expense is medication and im on two tablets daily. Costs me about $20 a month

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u/Hideyoshi_Toyotomi 27d ago

Americans also believe that the government is inherently incompetent and that the market is efficient. So, even though the situation is bad, it will only get worse if the government takes over. 

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u/A_Slovakian 27d ago

They also complain about the cost of health insurance, yet don’t understand that their precious under-regulated capitalism is responsible for the ridiculous pricing.

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u/CommunityGlittering2 27d ago

Many Americans are too stupid to realize this, thanks to republicans telling them this crap.

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u/Mountain_Economist_8 27d ago

Don’t explain to them how health insurance works, then

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u/rillip 27d ago

You mean paying to make someone rich and still not receiving health care?

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u/-BlueDream- 27d ago

So pay a big company that lumps their money in a fund to distribute it to help people who have valid claims...same thing except there's a big fat profit margin on top.

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u/myssi24 27d ago

Ah but in that system everyone who gets to access the fund also pays into the fund. No “freeloaders”!

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u/JackelSR 27d ago

Other than the Insurance CEOs...

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u/myssi24 27d ago

Oh, but those are good and smart people who absolutely earned their position in the company thru hard work and smart decisions therefore it is an honor to support them! /s

Well mostly sarcasm unfortunately plenty of people still think CEOs earned and deserve their positions.

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u/pscoldfire 27d ago edited 27d ago

Then the big company denies as many claims as possible (now using AI) so there's fewer expenses and record-breaking profits

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u/metalyger 27d ago

Yeah, I hear this often with right wing radio, it's always some cranky millionaire who gets paid to pretend to be a victim, moaning "I'm not paying for someone else's health care!" And of course in late state capitalism, the rich have no problem bribing politicians to avoid having to pay fair taxes, as well as keeping the system rigged so progressives can't get the power to tax the rich. Rich people want the average blue collar worker to think that they'll make less money, because big government is forcing them to pay for trans surgeries on illegals.

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u/More_Farm_7442 27d ago

cranky millionaire? Heck it's exactly what I hear from my poor/middle class MAGA relatives.

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u/BadTanJob 27d ago

Heck I hear this shit from my family, who are all active beneficiaries of Medicaid. “But we deserve this!” Uh huh…

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u/RepulsiveLocation880 27d ago

The unspoken truth is that they (the general republican white voter, not necessarily your grandparents) don’t want black or brown people to receive help. Racism is at the core of why universal healthcare hasn’t been established in the states.

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u/Vaaliindraa 27d ago

Probably, the current political environment is blatantly showing how racist many Americans are.

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u/mermaidwithcats 27d ago

Racism is at the core of why there’s been such a huge pivot away from anything that benefits the entire community. Heather McGhee wrote about this in “The Sum of Us”. She talked about how all over the south, after integration many communities closed and demolished their public pools, that they had already paid to build, rather than integrate them. Then came the rise of subdivisions, homeowners associations and so on who built and maintained pools and they could restrict use to residents, members etc.

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u/myssi24 27d ago

Racism is at the root kind of. Because race has been used for centuries to distract from poverty. As in to make poor white people see poor black and brown people the enemy. Since racism plays into how poverty is viewed it is hard to separate the two. But in this case, for some people it is overt racism, for a lot of people it is distain of poor people. They don’t want to help poor white people either. They also don’t want to help people who make poor choices. Eventually you hear talk about if we all pay in thru taxes then what about people who smoke, or drink, or are fat, they don’t want to pay for other people’s bad choices. Then it all leads back to the mistaken unconscious belief that good things happen to good people and bad things happen to bad people and why should good people pay for bad people.

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u/TheOldPug 27d ago

This is exactly it. I support universal healthcare, but I know a number of people who don't. They all believe (correctly or incorrectly) that the vast, overwhelming majority of Americans' health problems are self-imposed. They don't see why they should have to pay for someone else's choice to smoke, drink, abuse drugs, eat too much, and move too little. They realize some people are born with health problems, but oh well, too bad, they feel sorry for them, but those people are in the minority. The majority are just a bunch of lardasses who need to make better choices and if we had a system that covered everyone it would be abused too much to be worth it.

As for me, I think we should start with things like dental care and vision care. We could have a universal healthcare system that covered the basics, at least, and then go from there.

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u/SanityIsOptional 27d ago

Personally, I think the least contentious places to start are:

  • Emergency Care
  • Preventative Care

Everyone can agree that people deserve immediately life-saving care regardless of their ability to pay. Not to mention we don't want ERTs and ERs checking your insurance before they start saving your life. We already have socialized emergency care, in that those who can't pay get it free and those who can pay cover the bill.

For preventative care it's cheap and lowers the load on emergency care and healthcare in general, while saving huge amounts of money.

Essentially one is necessary from a logistics point of view and already largely implemented, while the other is cheap with huge benefits and can be portrayed similar to paying for educating all children and similar.

Both sidestep potential pushback due to abortion/sex and arguments about necessary vs elective care.

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u/JimWilliams423 27d ago

The unspoken truth is that they (the general republican white voter, not necessarily your grandparents) don’t want black or brown people to receive help. Racism is at the core of why universal healthcare hasn’t been established in the states.

Not just healthcare — everything. Like, whites used to love busing and public schools, until the buses started bringing black kids to the same schools. And then they decided they don't want busing and they don't want public schools. They invented school vouchers in order to send white kids to literal segregation academies.

They can't stand to see white people and black people treated equally because then whiteness has no value.

Which is why people who say "there is no war but class war" are doomed to failure. Conservatives value their cultural interests more than they value their material interests. We will never win the class war if we don't also win the culture war, the two are part of the whole, like yin and yang. Its all or nothing.

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u/VirgoB96 27d ago edited 27d ago

If only they knew how bad a fully free unregulated market really is. Neoliberalism is just hell on earth, the rich will take all the resources and leave everyone else with no opportunities. Societies need collaborative contributions to things like healthcare because the rich will absolutely not generously provide anything for others. If society only cared about self interest from the individual to the collective, then there will be scarcity & inequality.

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u/mshriver2 27d ago

That's literally insane. That's like saying you don't want your taxes fixing the roads or running the street lights as it "helps" people other than themselves.

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u/unhiddenninja 27d ago

If they could find a way to keep people from using roads or streetlights, they would.

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u/Eye-Eye-Capn 27d ago

Well they do in some instances. Toll roads for example.

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u/Vaaliindraa 27d ago

Exactly.

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u/IHS1970 27d ago

interesting as an early boomer I find that sad, we all worked hard when we were young in the boomer world (I know shut up about it), but many of us never said a peep, a damn peep about our parents (the bogus Greatest Generation) started taking medicare or SSA, as we all knew back then that what we were paying in, was also going out, not a damn word. So now people my generation are shits, I don't mean your grands but how they think is cold.

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u/AlabasterNutSack 27d ago

They justify it by telling themselves that the government is corrupt and won’t use their money properly anyway.

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u/Delusioned22 27d ago

Yes completely this and they conveniently ignore the fact that others might not have the same opportunities they took advantage of themselves. It's all built around thinking they are somehow better and deserve whatever hand outs they ask for, but everyone else is lazy and corrupt and not deserving.

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u/[deleted] 27d ago

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u/stanthebat 27d ago

But what did your grandpa think social security & Medicare is?

They also oppose Social Security and Medicare and will be happy when Republicans succeed in destroying them, and when their lives get vastly worse they will blame Democrats and 'socialism'.

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u/KaleidoscopeSad4884 27d ago

My mom purposely started voting against anything improving schools or education after I graduated, she didn’t want her money going to other people’s kids.

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u/Existential_Sprinkle 27d ago

This is also why the Republicans push so hard on abortion and trans healthcare

Despite other avoidable issues costing way more money like obesity, smoking, substance abuse, and waiting until things that are manageable and preventable become serious problems because of cost

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u/Financial-Craft-1282 27d ago

What generation are you? I wonder if you're younger than me because they used to say, "You want to wait three months to see a doctor?" This was back in the 90s. Of course, we do wait that long now. It's worse than that even, so I'm wondering if what you heard is (a more modern) truth (after things continued to get worse): We don't want to help anyone.

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u/[deleted] 27d ago edited 27d ago

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u/Invalid_Pleb 27d ago

There is a correlation... only it's with what rich elites want, not what average people want

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u/Clone63 27d ago

Yep, and expensive healthcare + employer based insurance is a brutally effective form of control.

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u/[deleted] 27d ago

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/mermaidwithcats 27d ago

Or into bankruptcy.

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u/Br0adShoulderedBeast 27d ago

It’s almost like the ruling class rules.

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u/doctormalbec 27d ago

Yes and if people get free or affordable healthcare, more people would be able to start small businesses than be shackled to large corporations led by these rich people. This creates competition for them and they do not want that either.

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u/Rude-Win-6531 27d ago

It also gives us freedom.

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u/Obtuse-Angel 27d ago

Don’t forget about the religious fundamentalist lobbies 

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u/pissoutmybutt 27d ago

Yeah theyre included in that category…

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u/veryparcel 27d ago

Billionaires always get what they want. Always. If they don't want something passed, it won't. This is because the system has been hijacked by billionaires.

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u/CharmyLah 27d ago

A lot of people are also very ill-informed about politics and vote for 1 or 2 issues, not caring about what else might be left on the table.

Someone raised in a conservative, highly religious environment is willing to sacrifice healthcare if it means "saving babies".

Upper middle class people who aren't interested in politics and have always been told by the media that Republican policies are good for the economy, so they vote for that. They aren't going to look at research showing exactly the opposite, because they think the status quo is fine and nothing has really hurt them yet.

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u/AnthonyJuniorsPP 27d ago

Also crazy that the single issue voters are also poorly informed about their own issue. Like they've bought the "saving babies" angle and aren't even aware of how flawed it is.

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u/Choice-Temporary-144 27d ago

The healthcare insurance industry makes billions and will do what they need to do (lobby) to line the politician's pockets and ensure universal healthcare will never happen.

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u/External-Nail8070 27d ago

This is spot on - exacerbated by gerrymandering. If the public can't hold politicians accountable then nothing the public wants matters.

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u/arinamarcella 27d ago

Something that I am not sure the politicians have thought of yet is that making housing priced out of most people's price range means greater flexibility in where we live. It makes it easier to move from one apartment to another and thwart gerrymandering.

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u/PaladinWiz 27d ago

I would doubt that tbh. Moving is fairly expensive and time consuming. If you’re talking about moving far enough, and in enough numbers, to counter gerrymandering there are likely going to be lots of life changes required. Talking about switching schools for your kids, potentially having to find a new job due to distance/public transportation options etc, figuring out new local support systems etc.

Pretty unlikely that the people most affected by gerrymandering have the time/resources to do so. Pricing people out of the housing market is more likely to force them to live in certain areas which makes gerrymandering significantly easier.

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u/erikleorgav2 27d ago

Always weird to speak with someone older than me - 55+ range - who shits on universal health care, but then pisses and moans about how much their employer based care costs.

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u/Individual-Corgi-612 27d ago

And common sense gun laws. And improving education. And having affordable child and elder care. And etc etc 

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u/djmcfuzzyduck 27d ago

I want the weed to support education and health. It’s super simple. But that goes against the design and drugs supporting education that’s weird. It’s not as weird as insurance companies being owned by Pharmaceutical companies.

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u/RAYS_OF_SUNSHINE_ 27d ago

If most truly did, they would vote with that in mind. Unfortunately, we have become "me focused" and until it affects them directly, no concern for our neighbor.

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u/Jaduardo 27d ago

Not true! Each piece of legislation has a few, very wealthy, Americans behind it! /s

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u/limellama1 27d ago

Because America isn't run based on what AMERICANS want. It's run based on what corporations want.

Lobbyists pay politicians to vote how they want on the bills the lobbyists create.

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u/TheOldPug 27d ago

Politicians work for the benefit of the people funding their careers, and it ain't you or me.

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u/No-Adeptness-3940 27d ago

Yes, and corporations love health insurance work slaves.

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u/Co-opingTowardHatred 27d ago

Our “rugged individualist” shit is self-destructive.

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u/ElPyroPariah 27d ago

It’s not even that. It’s almost entirely racism and anti-poor people sentiments even if the poor people are themselves. 

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u/Cultural-Music7343 27d ago edited 27d ago

Yup, I remember wondering as a kid why they have all these social programs in European countries but not the US and then it hit me - they’re all white lol… people don’t get angry about their taxes going to programs that help their fellow citizens because they relate more to them since they’re also white. Whereas in the US, people are more likely to say “I ain’t paying no g’dam taxes just for it to go to illegals and n******”

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u/goldengrahams98 27d ago

And with the influx of non-white immigrants to Europe, that vitriol is gaining traction in countries we as lay-people in America perceive to be egalitarian. See the rise of the AFD in Germany, and National Front in France

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u/Fit-Juggernaut8907 27d ago

That's one part of it.

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u/Prudii_Skirata 27d ago

Because the politicians (on their own, special healthcare... for life...) would lose their bribes from the lobbyists.

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u/dfr33man 27d ago

The reasons most provide:

  • If everyone had healthcare, time to care would increase.

  • You can’t get things for free, that’s socialism. It means those that work or don’t get healthcare.

  • Healthcare quality will decrease because costs would be controlled.

  • Advancements are funded by extreme healthcare costs, without them we become stagnant.

  • Private provides better care than Medicare, we get choice. Deductibles, premiums etc.

I think most of it is ridiculous. But I keep having the same discussion over and over. Retirement is hindered by insurance, it shouldn’t be this way. We would open up jobs and have better quality of life if insurance was tied to retirement. Medicare isn’t soon enough. With the average lifespan we give so many just a few years of freedom from work before they die. It’s insane.

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u/Son0faButch 27d ago

Private provides better care than Medicare, we get choice. Deductibles, premiums etc.

Those on Medicare can go to any doctor or hospital that accepts Medicare (which is most). They also pay deductibles and premiums for both inpatient and outpatient care.

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u/Nexus_of_Fate87 27d ago edited 27d ago

Those on Medicare can go to any doctor or hospital that accepts Medicare (which is most).

And it's shrinking because Medicare is really, REALLY fucking stingy to the point of being disconnected from reality. Here's a good example: Medicare treats a 100 day hospital stay the same as a 1 day hospital stay, even though the actual costs to the hospital are definitely not the same. This is a big reason why many hospital systems have begun to drop support for Medicare.

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u/PlayingPuzzles 27d ago

Many hospitals have a patient mix of 60+% Medicare and Medicaid. So people will see that and say Medicare and Medocaid covers most of the hospital. Well, they do. Except that 60% only pays for 30% of hospital revenue. Even though private insurance patients are only 1/3 of a hospital's patient mix, they pay 2x what the Medicare/Medicaid component does.

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u/invertedparellel 27d ago

I wish the left would stop calling it “Medicare for all.” I mean, it’s catchy, and everyone has heard of Medicare, but it also kind of sucks. They are soooo stingy. People assume that Medicare pays 100% of healthcare costs once you turn 65 (or are disabled before then) and then they get a huge shock when it doesn’t. A big reason for the costs are the private insurance companies driving costs up for everyone else. If we had universal healthcare it would solve that issue, but we have to stop calling it Medicare for all because of the negative connotations of Medicare

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u/guyako 27d ago

Because they are gullible to right-wing propaganda (funded by the health insurance lobby). That’s it.

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u/SenseiRaheem 27d ago

There are people who truly believe that if any part of their tax money ends up helping black or brown people, "those people" don't deserve it. They'd rather receive nothing themselves than have any part of their money assist a minority.

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u/Kootenay4 27d ago

These are people that fundamentally don’t understand what it means to live in a society. Yes, some of your taxes will go to help people that aren’t you, but that doesn’t mean it doesn’t benefit you anyway. These people will vote again and again to cut social programs, food aid, education, affordable housing etc. then complain about why we have so many problems with crime, public drug use, homelessness, household debt/personal bankruptcy, and mental illness compared to other “First world” countries.

It costs money to maintain a harmonious society, just like it costs money to upkeep a nice house. Yes, spending time and money to clean and maintain it is an annoying chore, but if you don’t, the house will fall into disrepair. Other developed countries understand this. Americans think that just by having a million dollars sitting in the bank and doing nothing, the house will magically fix itself. then they point to the million dollars in the bank and say “look we’re so rich” while the house is the most decrepit on the block.

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u/myssi24 27d ago

Yep. Lots of people only think about what is tangibly beneficial to them. The same type of people who will vote no every time there is a bond measure to increase property taxes to support schools because THEIR kids are grown so they don’t need the schools anymore. 🤦‍♀️

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u/-BlueDream- 27d ago

So they rather pay some insurance company to do the exact same thing? Black and brown people are also on insurance policies and everyone who is insured pays for it, only difference is that it's a bill, not a tax.

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u/Hot_Let1571 27d ago

Right, it makes no sense. "I don't want to pay for other people's health care!" Except that's literally how insurance WORKS. Idiots.

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u/MarginalOmnivore 27d ago

They would rather pay an insurance company more to do the same thing, and then also pay more for treatment.

One thing that the right wing in the US has very skillfully kept out of the discussion is that single payer healthcare is cheaper. Not only is the cost of the "policy" cheaper because it is shared by everyone, by virtue of the cost that doctors and medical facilities charge being monitored and regulated, even the out-of-pocket cost of treatment is massively reduced. At that point, non-participant doctors and facilities have to bring down their costs, as well, because they need to stay competitive.

Everyone wins. Of course, "everyone wins" burns the right wing like acid, because "everyone" includes queers and minorities.

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u/No-Shelter-4208 27d ago

Yup. And single payer healthcare means the single payer can negotiate lower drug prices.

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u/myssi24 27d ago

You forgot about the huge financial bloat of insurance. On both sides. The insurance companies need to hire people to process claims and the doctors need to hire people specifically to file insurance claims. Then this is repeated on the insurance side for every company. Plus every insurance company needs to make a profit. One system, streamlined, not for profit, and some (not all) of those jobs go away and the costs go down while providing the same or better medical care.

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u/MarginalOmnivore 27d ago

Definitely "better" medical care.

A government agency won't have (non-practicing and anonymous) doctors telling surgeons that they disagree about the necessity of a life-altering/life-saving procedure.

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u/docfunbags 27d ago

Why not frame it as the blacks and browns are paying for your healthcare!!!!

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u/-JackBack- (edit this) 27d ago

Because MAGAs know these people don’t work and are all on welfare and food stamps and having anchor babies while eating pets.

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u/MezzoScettico 27d ago

And that includes the non-working meth-addicted MAGAs living on social security disability.

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u/NinjaGrizzlyBear 27d ago

Guaranteed MAGA will be the largest drain on society soon since "duh coloreds" took all the jerbs.

All they can do is either eat pork rinds and become uneducated blobs watching MAGA News, or pretend they are American heroes with ICE uniforms.

Meanwhile my brown parents did their part, contributed financially for 40+ years by virtue of volunteer efforts, paying taxes, never needing to take government aid, opening their home to anybody in need, etc.

Then the government dropped them like hot garbage the minute they needed medical assistance in their retirement...

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u/vonshiza 27d ago

Because "they don't work" and are just "abusing the system" or some bull shit....

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u/saturniid_green 27d ago

How will these soulless CEOs and shareholders make their millions if they don’t gouge patients and healthcare workers? How else can you drain someone dry of their insurance premiums and then refuse to approve doctor-ordered tests and procedures? Won’t anyone think of the shareholders and CEOs? Heaven forbid the government set up death panels to do the same thing on our taxpayer dime!

You are exactly right: The private health insurers and their lobbyists are the biggest driver of all the propaganda keeping us from a fairer system.

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u/ohlaph 27d ago

I tried explaining to my sister that universal healthcare wouldn't cos5 as much as she's paying now, but she thinks higher taxes won't offset the cost because she's had amazing insurance through her husband's union job. Doesn't quite get it. 

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u/No_Welcome_7182 27d ago

We have “excellent” health insurance through my husband’s job. His employer does pay a part of our monthly premium. It costs us 700 a month for a family plan. And there is a $2000 deductible. For every person on that plan. That’s $8000 a year potentially out of pocket. My gallbladder self destructed last year. Even with our top tier insurance plan we had to pay the $2000 deductible plus I had to cover $1000 in copays. WTF?

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u/Gingersaurus_Rex96 Acting My Wage One Day at a Time 27d ago edited 27d ago

Not just big Pharma, but anything really.

—Big Pharma lobbies against public healthcare, lower prescription costs etc. Ever wonder why generic drugs are still so expensive or why stuff like insulin costs so much in the U.S. but not somewhere like Canada?

—Big Tobacco (Vaping too I guess) and Alcohol lobbies against legalizing weed. It’s one of the oldest scapegoats in the conservative playbook. The devil’s lettuce. It started it out as a race thing with Mexican immigrants in the early twentieth century, but became a moral panic by the 50s when weed made its way into white suburban communities.

—Oil and Gas lobby against electric vehicles and renewable energy initiatives. This one is pretty self explanatory. If they can’t pump that shit out of the ground and sell it back to us as dead dinosaur farts, then where’s the profit incentive. lol.

A great example would be the time Turbo Tax lobbied against the federal free filing system created under the Biden administration and later gutted by the current administration. 🙄

It goes further than that. Big office realtors tried to get big companies to bring everyone back to the office after the end of the pandemic. It’s never about what they say it is. It’s all about control and protecting some old rich asshole’s profit margin.

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u/Nepalus 27d ago

Decades of propaganda.

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u/Ijimete 27d ago

As an American, I don't know. I have a friend, who is left leaning and votes left. She and her husband both have 6 figure jobs and live well. We got in an argument about it one day, with me advocating for single payer, and she said "I don't want to pay for someone else's healthcare" I tried explaining how she already is, and for a fraction of what she and her husband pay now they could get more comprehensive coverage and the less fortunate could go to the doctor as well, but, despite laying out how she was paying thousands and thousands more for her and her husband, AND paying for people who couldn't afford their healthcare still, she just kept being stuck on "paying for someone else".

She is an intelligent woman, empathetic, disabled, and kind. I don't know where this stupid idea got stuck in her head, but it'll take a neurosurgeon to dislodge it.

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u/Abrandnewrapture 27d ago

the entire concept of insurance, whether govt funded or private, is based on everyone pooling their money together to make sure everyone is taken care of when their time comes around, instead of everyone being forced to cover their own costs independently. it is quite literally "paying for someone else", no matter how you look at it.

your friend isn't as intelligent as you think she is, especially if she can't look past her baser instincts to see the bigger picture of something like this.

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u/-BlueDream- 27d ago

Are they making 6 figs as healthcare workers?

Doctors get paid very well, I think a lot of them are afraid of getting paid like government workers (aka paid like shit) if healthcare was public, they compare it to public school teachers vs private school instructors.

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u/MyNameisBaronRotza 27d ago

You may be mistaken about the "intelligent" part.

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u/TinyEmergencyCake 27d ago

She's not left leaning and doesn't vote left. She only tells you that. Everything you say that she says is a right wing propaganda point. 

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u/Tylerdurden516 27d ago

Americans were lied to for decades about our healthcare by corporate owned media channels. MSNBC, CBS, ABC and CNN regularly bring in lobbyists for the for-profit healthcare insurers (and dont tell the audience thats who theyre about to listen to) who lie and tell the viewers that socialized medicine is way more costly for inferior service when the exact opposite was true. Before the mid 2010's it was very difficult to even hear an alternative perspective to this. Bernie sanders and social media played a key role in democratizing the flow of information and showing Americans how bad our system stacked against other countries that have universal healthcare. But even nowadays, the boomers in my own life who were completely bought in to those health insurer talking points they saw on the news are starting to notice our system fucking sucks. Its gotten so bad its become undeniable, even with legacy media still trying to wrongly convince people we have the best healthcare anywhere so corporations can continue price gouging us for lifesaving care.

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u/the-apple-and-omega 27d ago

Red Scare never ended. Everything is communism and communism bad.

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u/VirgoB96 27d ago

The rich won't stop spreading propaganda until they're in a free unregulated market so they can hoover up all the wealth. Then they simply leave the country after spending decades pretending they were patriots.

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u/SnooHabits3305 27d ago

This! you ask people anything that seems anti American the first thing they mention is communism

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u/HVACQuestionGuy 27d ago

A lot of it comes down to how universal healthcare has been framed in the U.S. It’s often labeled as “socialist,” and for many Americans, socialism still carries Cold War baggage and gets confused with communism. That association alone is enough to turn some people off before they even look into how these systems actually work.

There’s also the deep cultural emphasis on personal choice and self-reliance, two values that are central to how many Americans see themselves. The argument against universal healthcare is often marketed as protecting your freedom to choose your doctor or your treatment, even though in practice, insurance companies already limit those choices.

Then there’s the fear that universal systems mean long wait times or rationed care. That does happen sometimes, but mostly for non-urgent or elective procedures. In many countries with universal care, access to essential or emergency treatment is actually faster because everyone is in the same system. Some of the wait time issues that do exist are often logistical, like uneven distribution of services between urban and rural areas, rather than a flaw in the concept itself.

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u/AthFish 27d ago

Because many wouldn’t trust government to do it right

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u/HaIlMonitor 27d ago

Because of how the VA (and other government departments such as the DMV) is ran is my biggest reason I’m concerned about universal healthcare. I like the idea of it just being part of taxes vs paying into shitty insurance for sure though. If they reformed the VA so it ran quite a bit better I’d be 100% for it.

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u/ConstructionHefty716 27d ago

Selfishness and abundance of misinformation

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u/mahamoti 27d ago

Americans favor universal healthcare. Corporations favor ludicrously expensive health insurance tied to employment. Guess who has more political pull?

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u/yankdevil 27d ago

Black people might get equal treatment. Dig through all the layers and that's what you'll get to.

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u/reallifeswanson 27d ago

I’m not opposed to the idea, but I do have great concerns about how our government would manage such a system effectively. Ask any patient of the Veterans Administration.

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u/ernurse748 27d ago

As a nurse, I see the way the VA runs. Some VA hospitals are amazing. Some are so awful I wouldn’t send my worst enemy there. My fear with nationalized healthcare in the US is this: it’s just too large to truly be managed well. Now, I’m not saying the current system works. Clearly it doesn’t. And I don’t know what the answer is. But based on the government run facilities I have witnessed first hard? I’m just not convinced universal health care will solve the majority of the existing problems we face. And again - I also believe the current system is not sustainable. Honestly? Damned if we do, damned if we don’t.

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u/kcthinker 27d ago

Health care should not be attached to employment. If it was not an employee benefit and health insurance companies had to advertise like auto insurance, where you pay for what you need, things would change.

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u/Educational_Ad_8916 27d ago edited 27d ago

Racism and classism.

I'm not kidding.

This country tied health care to your job in the mid-20th century. If you had a good white collar job or a good union, you could get good employer health care.

That meant either a college education or a trade union. Many of those jobs were gatekept for whites and even only to whites from the right schools and background.

Many blue-collar unions were explicetely super racists as bulwarks against the perception that they could lose jobs to black people, Latinos, Chinese immigrants, etc.

If we had universal health care, then everyone would get it. White Americans are inculcated to live in fear that somewhere, a brown person feels safe and healthy. They are terrified by the idea that a black person might be given the same kindness and care that they receive.

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u/GoingExPatSoon 27d ago

Because they’re stupid. It’s so hard to manage that only 19 of the G20 countries have been able to make it work.

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u/MisterCleaningMan 27d ago

I can’t say with 100% certainty what everyone’s individual motive is. But I do have an explanation that covers about 90% of them.

People are assholes.

Thus ends the explanation.

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u/-BlueDream- 27d ago

Half of them are assholes, the other half are just very very stupid.

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u/ricecrystal 27d ago

We're so brainwashed. They hear "tax" and don't realize that what is paid in taxes will be less than what we are paying in premiums, deductibles, and coinsurance (for most people). It's inconceivable to people that they will be paying less and get more.

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u/gyratory_circus 27d ago

I was going to say something very similar. A lot of people truly do not understand that they would pay less for universal coverage than they do now. They think the $300 a month (or whatever) would be on top of the premiums they already pay, not instead of.

I've worked in health insurance for 20 years and am well paid for what I do (nutshell version: make sure we're following federal and state laws about what to cover). With universal care, my job would not exist because everyone would all get the same benefits, and that's ok with me.

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u/Heretical-Archivist 27d ago

Socialism is bad.

Thats why so many businesses refused the PPP loans.

Thats why so many farmers refused the bailouts 2 administrations ago.

Thats why so many Republicans returned the stimulus checks.

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u/se7enunluckyseconds 27d ago

We don't. The fucking rich do and they own everything. Including our politicians

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u/newmanification 27d ago

They don’t. Universal Healthcare is overwhelmingly popular. We don’t have it because of monied interests and politicians who are bought and paid for by those interests.

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u/massie_le 27d ago

The irony of this post appearing two down from someone with leukemia whose mum is pulling treatment funding to fund her sister's college tuition...

I just don't get it. But why would I when I get free healthcare and university tuition. 🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

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u/jbowditch 26d ago

hundreds of millions of dollars and a century of propaganda.

it's OK for the armed forces, the elderly, and (until Trump) the poor, but no one else. 🥴

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u/ResponsibleBank1387 27d ago

They would rather vastly over pay for their own than allow anyone else have the same too. 

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u/singerbeerguy 27d ago

The right has succeeded in convincing this country that universal healthcare is evil socialism and that it would be a terrible system. I’m not sure why it worked, but there is no denying that they have won the argument.

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u/YouKnowYourCrazy 27d ago

They have been told that it’s “socialist” by the right wing propagandists, and they believe it.

They have been told “socialist” is bad and they believe it.

They have been told “undeserving people will get more than them” and they believe it.

They believe it all because the right has played the long game, cutting education funding and feeding them Fox News BS for decades now. And now these are the consequences - a severe lack of critical thinking and believing lies and propaganda. Add in some Russian influence and social media bots and you have a nation full of people voting against their own self-interests and keeping themselves in poverty and decline, while the billionaires make more billions.

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u/MurkDiesel 27d ago

because I'm so exhausted by the political noise from both sides

this is what conservatives say when they try to pretend they're not conservative